Frédéric Bastiat must have been looking toward the future of the United States today when he said, “When plunder has become a way of life for a group of people living together in society, they create for themselves in the course of time a legal system that authorizes it, and a moral code that glorifies it.”
I fear the federal government will plunder much of our private wealth, retirement plans and personal savings through hyperinflation, financial controls and confiscatory tax rates all in the name of protecting the public from a future debt crisis unless the states can secede from the Union and the crushing Washington debt load.
The first actual secession following several attempts by the New England states took place in the South and it ended with the defeat of the Confederate States of America. Now secession is again in the news and this time it may be the only solution to surviving the coming Washington national debt crisis.
We need to forget the causes of the earlier War Between the States, regional differences, slavery, tariffs and other related issues. The new secession effort will be state-based but a national movement all across the United States ranging from Vermont to Georgia, Texas to Alaska etc. Economic survival and prosperity rather than regional issues will be motivating factor.
The first secession was a product of anti-southern tariff taxes resulting in the Southern states paying the majority of the revenue to fund the distant federal government. A mistaken defense of the dying institution of slavery by slaveholding elites in the South also contributed to the failed secession effort. Third, the advancement of corporate manufacturing profits and railroad expansionism by the Northeastern establishment elites were a major contributor. Finally the promotion of a conflict by the European Rothschild banking interests funding both the Northern abolitionists and the Southern secessionists guaranteed a violent breakup of what should have been a peaceful parting of the states.
Still the right of democratic state-by-state secession did not die at the point of a bayonet at Appomattox Court House in 1865. The belief in peaceful devolution of government powers and services to regions and local jurisdictions to allow citizens to control the power of politicians and government is a positive advancement for the 21st century. In addition, the right of devolution of states, geographic regions and groups around the world promotes competition and freedom.
I believe legal state secession from the Washington Empire just might become the only way for American citizens to escape the disastrous consequences from the coming global run to liquidate holdings of Washington treasury obligations and the dollar. Breaking free of the false chains that threaten our economic future from the likely Washington debt/dollar collapse might be our last chance to safeguard our financial security and liberty from the hyperinflation and crushing new tax increases to be forced on this and future generations from the bailouts and national debt.
Imagine no Washington income tax, no interference in the internal affairs of individual states, no involvement in perpetual wars around the world without a declaration of war, no Washington tax-feeding bureaucrats telling individual citizens, state legislatures or state agencies what to do.
Consider the benefits of sovereign states voluntarily participating in a decentralized republic or confederation, maybe like America’s first central government created by our patriot founding fathers, the Articles of Confederation. A decentralized nation where marriage, religious views, history, symbols, culture, abortion, gay rights etc. are determined on a state basis, Where citizens can eat, drink, smoke or do whatever with regulations and conduct governed by the norms of a state or locality rather than a distant federal government.
Can you envision a healthy economy, with minimal government debts combined with a rising standard of living and job growth guaranteed by low taxes, minimal regulations and currency competition? All of this without the Federal Reserve and Wall Street creating excessive bubbles followed by contraction and collapse and then demanding bailouts.
Imagine for a moment a people and sovereign states with future generations free from the illegitimate Washington national debt which threatens to destroy the prosperity, savings, housing values and jobs for our children and grandchildren. Review the US National Debt Clock which tells the entire story and our future. Today the official US National Debt breaks down to $40,079 per individual. Look at the clock link to see the increase per second.
Finally, when you consider the total unfunded liabilities of Washington (see the link above), the liability per American citizen is $177,515. Remember, none of the citizens of the individual states or America in general have had the opportunity to vote on the bailout or approve these debts most of which have gone to international corporations, Wall Street and world banking cartels. We, our children and future generations should not have to fund or pay off an illegitimate debt created just to bail out a few global corporations and wealthy special interests.
The Washington Empire is now run for the benefit of New York financial and economic interests who own and control most of Congress. Due to the recent bailouts and added debt which the majority of Americans opposed, the United States is now sadly on the path toward economic, debt and currency destruction.
Why should my state, South Carolina or other states join the federal government in future poverty, loss of freedoms and lagging economic prosperity with a dismal future determined by their foreign creditors? I say, it is time to free the states and citizens from the dark economic future which Washington and Wall Street have created. Just maybe we can finally be free at last from Washington’s national debt.
As Dr. Martin Luther King, from his I have a Dream speech said, “Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, we are free at last.” To quote another Southerner, Jefferson Davis was right when he stated, “I love the Union and the Constitution, but I would rather leave the Union with the Constitution than remain in the Union without it.”
I think it is time for Americans left and right to reconsider where our nation and the federal government have ended up. Few would question that the all-powerful Washington government living on borrowed debt and fake prosperity is a political model which has failed miserably.
Today the constitutional protections have become just another dead document through the actions of Bush and Obama. A recent, WSJ/NBC poll showed that only 3% of Americans believe the government is doing a good job. Given the margin of error in the poll, the real % could have been zero.
Let’s revisit the political wisdom of the original republic founded through the blood and sacrifice of our patriot founding fathers. Back to something like the original republic of sovereign state republics, the Articles of Confederation.
Today in 2010, join me in voting both for the dream of Dr. King and the vision of Jefferson Davis. It is time to replace the failed Washington leviathan with a new limited central government based on the original vision of sovereign states where we become again, “these United States” instead of “the United States.” I’m voting in 2010 and 2012 in support of the Tenth Amendment and for the right of nullification.
Finally, if necessary, I’ll support temporary secession efforts from the empire until we restore the original republic of our founding fathers. We must be free of an illegitimate national debt, an unconstitutional Federal Reserve and protected by currency competition and the choice of a currency based on the gold standard.
February 12, 2010
Editor’s Note: Read more about Ron Holland here.
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I am as disgusted as the next person with the current state of things in the USA. But are we ready to pledge ‘our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor’ to this secession nonsense?
I think not.
Perhaps all 50 states should leave the US and form a new country. This would be the same as just kicking DC out of the Union. “Oh I’m sorry, we’re not the country that issued those treasury bonds. You want the USA, that tiny country on the Potomac.”
Ron- An interesting concept to explore, but so is the transmutation of lead into gold. Each would be equally difficult to pull off. Imagine the logistics and turmoil.
Wow! This is a Action Now proposition.
Roger, to hell with the turmoil. Doing nothing and waiting to vote out a bunch of trash isnt getting things done. Individual states voting for secession now is doing something NOW.
You worry about logistics and turmoil. Wait till the house of cards caves in around us and watch what our rotten government will expedite upon all of us. They (Washington) will deal with logistics and turmoil alright!
And Dave, why do you Think Not? Do you have a better idea? It seems to me, that the clowns in Washington and in power in general have separated from the people in there own way already. They cant run a business.They cant listen. And they think we will do as we are told with out any back lash much less civil disorder. In short, they think we are inept fools. It is time to stop talking about this crap and do something because we have few years if not few months left. I dont feel responsible to pay a dime towards this government system of bail out everything from failed businesses to paying the free way of illegals.
I don’t think we will see it in our lifetimes, but I envision the U.S. being broken up into several regions (countries):
1. The north east with it’s particular philosophy
2. The south
3. The south west
4. The north west
5. The heartland
6. Great lakes
Some states would be split (e.g. half of Calif going to the south west; the other half going to the north west; the other half going to Mexico.)
Don’t ask me where the boundaries will be, nor quibble with my particular grouping. I won’t argue, I’ll just agree with you.
If you think about it, trying to govern groups as diverse culturally as a north eastern citizen, a southern, and a western guy with their culturally diverse personalities has got to be a difficult task.
Ron (Holland), your treatise was quite good, but you forgot the many states are in the same bind as the federal gubbermint, having spent far more than they have. Secession won’t/didn’t help them.
rebel without a job,
Never mind the F-ing economy and the criminals that run the show in DC. How many average citizens would die in the ensuing gun battles and arson attacks between your friends and those who disagree? How many more would die in the “precision” bombing and lightning strikes by the military that surely would follow for anything that looked even slightly like a target (can you say wedding anyone)? Or live through those nightmares and then die, or loose everything but their life, in the chaos that would ensue? How many of your – currently – fellow citizens would die of starvation or disease as the supply chains inevitably collapsed, possibly permanently? Of course none of THAT would EVER happen. Convince me otherwise but right now I think I’ll take plain old austerity..
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The new nation of the United States abandoned the Articles of Confederation in favor of the US
Constitution in 1788, just four years after their ratification by the states in 1783. So they knew better back then what was needed. Trying to regress to the Articles after over 200 years seems a little desperate.
Secession won’t be necessary because life will become localized real fast once the trucks stop bringing
the food in from out of state. By then Washington will seem pretty irrelevent once people begin
struggling to find food.
There are darker things to imagine here, like:
-Imagine millions of age 65+ Americans dying of starvation and disease because Social Security and Medicare have ceased to exist.
-Imagine almost every major city turning into an inhabitable war zone as Food Stamps and other welfare programs stop.
-Imagine Chinese nuclear missiles raining down on American cities in retribution for debt default. Imagine the now Disunited States unable to defend the country against any aggressor.
-Imagine Alaska seized by the Russians, and the West Coast invaded by the Chinese.
-Imagine civil war in almost every state, driven by ancient racial and religious hatred.
-And finally (10 years later), imagine a population of 305 million Americans reduced by 50 to 80 percent.
Of course, these things may happen anyway. However, why hurry things along?
You raise some interesting points, particularly with regard to the penchant for spending money we don’t have that seems to be so pervasive in D.C. However, you lose me when you make comments like, “Why should South Carolina join the federal government in future poverty….” It always seems like the people screaming the loudest are from net-gain states like SC. Your argument would be much more persuasive if you were to use a net-pay state, like MA perhaps, that actually contributes more in federal taxes than they receive back in benefits. SC has long been a virtual ward of the state, with it’s citizens receiving more from the federal government in direct and indirect aid than they pay in taxes to the federal government. In the end, secession is really a non-starter in this country for two reasons: First, those in power will not go quietly into the night. They will fight will all their available resources to retain the status quo, and I’m certain I don’t need to point out what considerable “resources” are available to them. And second, most sane Americans, being a aware of point #1, would be unwilling to commit themselves to such a cause, preferring instead to crack open another Budweiser and tune into American Idol, and believe the talking heads on TV that tell us everything’s going to be okay. Dissolution of this Union will most likely happen one day, perhaps not that far off, but it won’t be the result of secession; indeed, the end will likely come much like it happened in the Soviet Union, with the massive weight of a bloated and ineffective central government essentially imploding in upon itself, unable to finally respond to the needs of it’s people any longer.
WE the PEOPLE will overcome this threat to Our Great Nation!
In GOD we TRUST!!!
Surrender is not an Option!!!
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See: The Nine Nations of North America, Joel Garreau 1981
$100,000 upfront per head and your gone. Hell, SC sucks out more tax money than it sends in.
Maybe the USA should just expel the state.
Secession! Cool… let’s getter done!
Doing nothing now is like fishing without using a hook, like hunting without bullets, like getting a $300,000 mortgage while only getting paid to build burgers at the local McBurger joint.
Did ANYONE take a good look at the national debt numbers? It is mathematically IMPOSSIBLE to pay it back! IMPOSSIBLE! Why would anyone in their right mind give a rat’s ass about the consequences of secession?
Oh wait… because the hardest thing to have happen to one’s psyche is to have one’s personal paradigm about how the world behaves to be proven to be FALSE. Fact do not cease to be facts nor do they go away when they are conveniently ignored. “Oh my poor ego; oh my poor feelings…” Life’s not fair & it’s not fair that life’s not fair. Deal with it!
Secession? Cool… lets getter done!
So, even now, you, Americans, think only about yourselves. Not about the world’s poorest nations you plundered. Not about where all your wealth comes from. Not about PAYING your debts and starting a new, honest life. But only about how to abandon the sinking ship of your once almighty empire?
You have no conscience. No pride. No dignity. You are rats.
I like Bob @ 4:15, that is funny stuff. I also would like to start paying down our debt by using the foreign aid from what ever light weight, weak sister country that Anti-USA @ 2:23 comes from.
Yes “Anti USA” there are Unconcious, Prideless, Undignified Rodents here in America. They live in Washington DC and Wall Street. Thank you for pointing this out. As for Mike pull your thumb outta your mouth and grow some testicle. It’s whimps like you that voted the scavengers into office in the first place. As for me, a little thinning of the herd never hurt anyone, right?
I think secessation is the only answer. Main Street America is 0-for-4 on issues confronting them just this last year. We rose up on massive fashion agains the wars, against the bailouts and for Medicare for all and for a FED Audit, and we got nothing while the corporate elitists got everything they wanted including proof recently that they won the trifecta! The recent Supreme Court decison favoring corporate personhood proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that they now control the Judicial branch of government in addition to the legislative and executive branches.
Trillions for resource and heroin wars and to socialize corporate losses, and millions of new and unwilling customers for the reptile-brained insurance companies who got rewarded for marginalizing 50 million amaricans out of their right to health care, and the Fed Audit being blocked by the Treasury and FED Chiefs who are serving an international banking syndicate responsible for stealing the wealth of hard working Americans and their progeny. The Constitution has been completely subverted and the founding fathers are turning over in their graves. Screw narcissistic nationalism and blind faith in a strong central government, and screw the filthy turd this once great nation has turned into. Washington DC has betrayed the people and spent itself into irrellevancy. What the hell are we waiting for?
As if an all-powerful state government would be both benevolent and wise. Said state government would instantly be deprived of all federal aid, and would collapse in poverty immediately. Additionally, the federal gov’t won’t just let any state secede, it is against their best interest. There will be war, and the state will certainly lose.
Why are you reading and believing the BS of a SWISS BANKER?!
Jim, love your gun much? Help the heard by using it to thin your selfish self.
That happened with the population under Hitler. They shut up and took it. They were scared and they kept their mouths shut. The ones that spoke out were usually never seen alive again. Our government will make the Nazis look like novices before this is all over. What ever of the population that is left will conform and live controlled lives. Is that the form of austerity you desire?
Thats just great Dave. Our states are screwed up because they are always counting on that Federal Carrot . If a said state, does not do as Federal Government says, Federal Government wont give Federal aid. Guess what Dave, the Damned Federal Government and its programs for states dont work and the money is soon to be unavailable because the Damned Federal Government is BROKE. The states can go it alone if run like a business. True Americans do not desire Government control of their lives. You worry about war? Why ? They cant even fight the 2 wars they started and they are scared of their own Army.
What a great bunch of responses, with a few exceptions, of course. Anti-USA, we didn’t ask for your opinion and the chances are excellent that your country has had some of our ill-thought-out largesse. This is a family fight so stay out of it. We told those people 150 years ago, this year, that we wanted the nice, quiet “no fault” divorce we were promised when the South signed up and we still do. Even at the time there was great concern that two such different areas could ever get along, and sure ‘nough, we can’t. At least we don’t have any children, unless you count Alaska, Puerto Rico, and Hawaii, little things like that. The Polar Bear huggers need to realize that if the Russkis take Alaska they aren’t going to worry about seals, bears, and moose; they’ll take all the oil we should be using ourselves. The Feds have spent us into oblivion buying voting blocks and building private fortunes, and we’ll be lucky to stagger on another six months before something gives. You think talk of secession doesn’t scare every sensible person? Of course it does, but the status quo is extremely dangerous and degrading fast. I have a couple of articles coming up that some of you will love. Perhaps they will cause others to THINK about your personal safety and survival in times to come. The very BEST we can hope for is a very lengthy Greater Depression, complete with the inability to feed those who do not work. There is only so much wealth in any nation, and we have not only squandered ours we have made it almost impossible to build more. The other choices are dictatorship or civil war. Isn’t that a fun thought? Cordially, LBT
I’m not arguing that the federal gov’t is not broken and broke. I’m arguing that the idea of secession put forth by the Swiss Banker is ill-found and poorly visualized. As you say, the states ARE dependent upon the federal carrot, and that is why they cannot break away. To do so would mean an almost complete collapse. This is especially true in the case of states without income taxes like Florida and Texas. (I’m not advocating income taxes, so please don’t jump on me about that.)
The idea that states, absent a federal overlord, would suddenly become libertarian paradises is ludicrous. In actuality, what would happen is that the state gov’t would become a surrogate federal gov’t. All the problems we see at the federal level would suddenly materialize at the state level.
Let’s take Florida (where I live) as an example: Upon secession, Florida would suddenly have several very large problems. No Navy, no Army, and no way to defend itself or it’s borders. Tourism, the states primary source of income, would cease entirely, leaving nothing with which to fund the newly required defensive forces. The oil and gas pipeline that comes in from Louisiana to Tampa would be shut down, and industry and commerce would be strangled, once again eliminating a source of revenue for the state. The undoubted blockade and/or embargo would prevent Florida farmers from selling their oranges to those who live in the frozen north, resulting in personal and corporate bankruptcies by the tens of thousands. This would leave a large population both destitute and angry perhaps angry enough to rebel against the state government that put them into this position to begin with.
The libertarian utopia of a state separated from the US is just as flawed and impossible as the communist utopia of federal ownership of everything, DESPITE the assurances of a Swiss Banker
Love ya Big Dave. Prey or Preditor. I guess you exposed which one you are. Human, I understand is most tasty. May your chains rest lightly upon your carcus. They must as I’d bet you don’t even realize that in this Matrix the chains rest nicely already. Pardon any spelling errors. But you know how us Rubes with guns and religion am so ignorant. Gee, Dave I wish I could visit that Ivory Tower of great intellect in which you reside- that rodent mind of yours.
Well as Ms. Linda knows, talk of “Secession” always troubles me. So, this has led me to take a closer look at the document.
U.S. Constitution – Article 1 Section 10
[Powers Prohibited of States]
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.
No State shall, without the Consent of the Congress, lay any Imposts or Duties on Imports or Exports, except what may be absolutely necessary for executing it’s inspection Laws: and the net Produce of all Duties and Imposts, laid by any State on Imports or Exports, shall be for the Use of the Treasury of the United States; and all such Laws shall be subject to the Revision and Controul of the Congress.
No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay.
Later in Article 4:
New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new States
shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any
State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or parts of States,
without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of
The Congress shall have Power to dispose of and make all needful Rules and
Regulations respecting the Territory or other Property belonging to the United
States; and nothing in this Constitution shall be so construed as to Prejudice
any Claims of the United States, or of any particular State.
The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican
Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on
Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature
cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.
Now in Article 6 the framers showed great honor in clearly stating that they would not default on previous debts:
All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this
Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this
Constitution, as under the Confederation.
While the Amendments 9 & 10 can be used to imply that there is a “Right of Secession”, it is clear from the text of the Articles that proceed the Amendments that the Framers did not explicitly spell out a mechanism for Secession. While I respectfully remain willing to be educated on this subject, I did notice something else in the text that deserves to be debated in view of the fact that this is a Census year and what that means to U.S. House of Rep. redistricting.
From Article 1: “The Number of
Representatives shall not exceed one for every thirty Thousand, but each State
shall have at Least one Representative;”
Since we have had a static number of House Districts at 435 since around the 1920’s and the population has continued to steadily increase, Congress must have legislated its way around the 30,000 “registered voters” per district rule. So now the House is too small to properly represent the interests of the populous. We are back to the old argument of “Taxation without Representation”
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There was a time when people realized that the federal government was by and for the people and if something was wrong, they acted to make it right. Now we’ve come to a time of just giving up hope. Sure, I vacillate at times, but I know that together, as a large nation, we can accomplish far greater things and make life far better than apart. We only have to get the nation out of the yoke of control of the superrich parasites. But this has been the same problem since the founding days of the republic. Don’t forget how Jefferson fought with the bankers of his day. In the end, I think we need to look at what Lincoln did– greenbacks, a national currency directly issued by the government, a government at least in substantial ways subject to democratic controls rather than a private, secret bank (the “Fed”) operating with no democratic controls. Just imagine how much easier it will be for a disorganized, fragments set of states to be exploited by those same bankers. Just the recipe for far worse conditions, for little tinpot dictatorships run for solely for the rich. I know it looks bad now, but we need to get back the attitude we had as a nation before this negative anti-government ideology took hold and narrowed our vision of what we are capable of as a nation, using the people’s government. That is what American patriotism is really all about. Where are you patriots?
Yes, that makes a lot of sense, let’s all seceed! That is the answer, then we’ll have a collection of 50 poor states instead of one poor union. Will each mint and print it’s own money?, each backed by the “faith and security”of that state? Um, well that seems impractical, so let’s just all agree to use a common currency, but, and I mean this, we will control the amount we print/mint, and maybe back it by gold. Good, good, so far so good. You know, we should all probably go in for a unified defense of the territory, so maybe we join and pitch in for a common army, navy and air force, this only makes sense because then we have an economy of scale and it will cheaper for each overall. Then it’s probably not fair if one of the States decides to “relax” it’s pollution laws and then all the corporations locate there and then that State then gets all the jobs, so we should probably have a pact and common ideas on pollution laws (else some States will go like China which is both manufacturer and major river-polluter of the world). Now one of the nice things – positive things – about the United States the last 150 yrs is its slow, sometimes fit-full, sometimes a step backwards or two, hard slog march to greater individual freedoms and liberty for all, and not were a small vocal group, or large conservative group, dictates ways of life for non-majority groups – you know, like the old New England Salem witch trials, the McCarthy era, the 40s/50s/60s civil rights movements, (not to mention slavery), etc… so, maybe, so we don’t repeat these less than stelllar marks of our and world’s history, we also agree to adopt a common set of freedom and liberty principles, so that a non-majority group is not beat up and oppressed. If not, then we’ll loose perhaps America’s greatest legacy – equality and civil rights (which still is a program not quite finished) and descend into the decreptitude of civil rights that is now what one finds in present day Russia and most countries in Africa. Since the Taliban in Afghanistan or the Whahbi in Saudi Arabia are technically the majority in many parts of those countries, is it “right” for them then to tell everyone else where they live, how to live? That’s what an outright majority dictating “moral principles” gets you (idiots).
Perhaps a better way is to keep the union we have now but scale it back, say in defense spending (you know the US has something like 30,000 nuclear bombs/missles/warheads and they cost a helluva lot to keep up. I thnk China has a few hundred. So maybe Eisenhower – a Republican, perhaps the last decent Republican we’ve had – was right when he said, basically, “don’t let defense spending get out of hand”).
Another point is to educate (and by the way that is _not_ spelled with a “j” for those without the benefit of schooling) the American people on how the govt. works, what it spends money on, and how much “taxes” are collected, and who’s paying what. They might see that, an average of 22% gross income maybe is not all that bad to pay for a road system, defense, soc. security, etc.., and that adding another 5%, while not greeted with joy, is in fact looking like a bargain if it prevents the collapse or hyperinflation of the currency, which would then make your current savings and future retirement worth a lot less. If it brings down the US debt, then markets around the world will sleep better at night and so will we. In conclusion then, a little more cutting here and there, and a few more percentage points in what we annually pay for it all (those are called “taxes”). Yes, all that you see around you that works when you want it and is regualted how we want it, doesn’t, in the end, cost for free or grow on trees.
As Ms. Linda knows I find talk of “Secession” emotionally troubling. I took a look at the Constitution yesterday and the Framers never spelled out a specific mechanism. Yes, Amendments 9 & 10 can be used to flog the argument that their is an implied right. However, in Article 1 section 10 (concerning the perogatives of Congress) it clearly spells out what powers the States do not have as part of joining the Union and the protections (like from forgein invasion) the Union is responsible for providing. Later in Article 4 the text examines the admission of new States to the Union. Its kinda like the Mob or the CIA, once a member always a member.
Also, you have to give the Framers credit, they had the honor and guts to clearly state to the world in Article that they would pay off the Confederation debt. Now with this being a Census year and what that means for redistricting the House seats makes that little note in Article 1 about each seat being districted for 30,000 “registered voters” might be something to question the Supremes about. I think since around the 1920’s we have been holding steady at 435 House seats, yet the population as steadily increased. This would lead one to think that the Congress Critters have legislated their way around the 30,000 number. This puts us back at the original argument about “Taxation without proper Representation”. The House needs to be expanded…
Artie Em, I wish more thought like you. You are dead-on right
Two words Artie, Oakum’s Razor. Any idiot can wax ‘uneloquently’ making any topic of conversation more complicated. The true genius can take a complicated topic and make it simple. E=Mc2 etc. Or how about this one? Secession from the Federal Reserve. Contrary to popular belief they are a private Banking Cartel. If we secede from them it’s their debt and they’ll have the burden of Bankruptcy for the mess they’ve created. Maybe they can pay it off with more of that worthless fiat paper they force us to eat. I’m for Congress printing our Money Backed By Gold if there’s any left at Ft. Knox.
(and by the way it’s spelled ‘lose’ for those without the benefit of schooling)
‘If not, then we’ll loose perhaps America’s greatest legacy ‘
Seccecssion in a orderly legal way , if successful, is the only alternative to that which lies before the People
of the United States of America. (US citiczens are merely corporate entities who have unknowingly pledged
their titled property to the government in Washington pursuant to the ‘full faith and credit clause’ to the Constitution operating under Art. I (which is a corporate jurisdiction) to satisfy the present national debt.
However, the citizenry was not informed of this as required under the Uniform Commercial Code subsection UCC 1-203 which requires every party to any agreement/contract to ‘act in good faith’ ,therefore,
the federal government, by not informing the citizenry they they were pledging all their titled property to D.C.
to saiisfy the national deby the government has committed ‘fraud in the factum’ contrradicting UCC 3-305(2)(c) requierments thereby enabling discharge of all liabilities (nat. debt) by the States/Citizenry and enabling
seccession by the states.
I find it fascinating that the only name/moniker readily identifiable as feminine is MINE. If all goes according to schedule, gentlemen, in a day or two you will have the fun of agreeing or tearing into me over an article entitled “The New Secessionists.” Michael, Jim, Ted, and Mark play on my team, please. Jim, you’re delegated to make snide comments I am supposed to deny myself, if you will. A. Spohrn, go do your homework. Kwark and Mike, I suppose y’all will continue to play devil’s advocate, and a jolly time will be had by all. Vae victis! Linda
While I hesitate to quote Mike Savage, I cannot help but believe his “definition” of a country is “borders, language, and culture” is somewhat accurate.
I suspect that, although we may not see it in our lifetime, the good ole U.S.A. will break up into several countries:
1. The South
2. The North East
3. The North West
4. The South West
6. (Perhaps) The Great Lakes, and The West
If we go back to Savage’s “culture”, does anyone believe that the “intellectual” of the North East has much in common with the Kansas farmer? How about a South Carolina tobacco farmer with an anti-tobacco Californian? Take a look at my divisions and ask yourself, “How in heck did we keep such a bunch of diverse groups together this long–particularly with a government that plays each one against the other in terms of benefits.”
Splendid analysis, as always, Tony. The only thing I see missing is “Mexifornia,” which the invaders we support want to rename “Aztlan,” to be comprised of (at least) Southern California and the widening blue strip which can be seen on the political map. Consider, too, the possiblity of a restored Republic of Texas perhaps incorporating some of the five surrounding states–not counting the portions that are included in the borders of said Republic. I can envision Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, Utah, and perhaps part of Nevada banding together. The only trouble with our intellectual game of Risk is that it will entail gore and destruction, with the consolation that it will be a side-effect of other political and economic pressures. I’m rooting for the Hawaiians who want back Queen Liliuokalani’s throne and Iolani Palace! Linda
It seems as though there should be a way to stop paying the federal reserve any and all taxes, thus stoping the government and this all out theft of our freedom. If everyone,including companies, would simply refuse to file tax reports in April, as well as monthly or quarterly reports, the government would have no recourse.. There simply isn’t enough jails in this country to handle the masses and I don’t think the goverment,at this point, would have the power to enforce any efective push for controlling the masses behind the drive to force the government to do the peoples bidding!!! HOW DO WE, THE PEOPLE, ATTACK THIS IN A MANNER THAT WILL WORK FAST ENOUGH. OFFER IDEAS
Great piece Ron Holland
Oh, and Linda you didn’t mention the North West States joining Western Canada, that is B.C., Alberta, Sakatchewan, Manitoba and the Yukon. Along with Alaska we would have one of the most dynamic and prosperous entities the world has ever seen. Just a thought and what a great article to get people thinking and writing on their diverse, contradictory and many times agreeable views. A lot of fun anyway.
Best Regards, CanadaNorth
That was my second attempt to post the idea. In my first one, I stated, “Don’t try to argue with me about which states will band together with each other–I’ll simply agree with you.”
I can easily see California split in two with half going to the Pacific Northwest and the other half going to the South West. There has been talk of splitting California into two states for at least 50 years. The Southern part of the state has little in common with the SF Bay area, and neither has much in common with the northern part of the state. I can also see it emerging as it’s own country–it has little in common with anyone; even itself.
I can easily imagine Texas as a soverign country, however I could also see it split and aligned with New Mexico, and Oaklahoma as one country–perhaps even including Arizona, and the eastern half aligned with some of the southern states. Texas is rather large, and the folks in the west have little in common with the folks in the east–other than pride in being “Texans”, which may be enough to hold it together. I can also see it remaining intact and “picking up” Oaklahoma and New Mexico. Perhaps even Arizona.
The problem that Ron Holland doesn’t address is, “How, once you secede, do you keep the NEW gubbermint from overspending?” Examples enough abound today where they have overspent when they are restricted by “balanced budget” requirements.
p.s. It is fairly well known that Texas has the authority to break up into 5 states at it’s pleasure. It is also known that Texas is fairly conservative.
NOW, suppose a Texas delegation went to congress and said:
Here’s the deal. Either you let us secede, or we break up into 5 states and generate 8 more conservative senators. If we secede, you lose two conservative senators.
Of course, it must be done while the liberals are in control.
And here’s my snide remark Linda…Got none. In just two of my postings, ” You’ve nailed me to a T. ” Whatever that means. If you know please explain it to a poor Southern Rube like me. Thanks for letting me on your team though. Warning, I eat tasty people when there’s famine about. As for CALIMEX, where do you suppose all of us non Pablos and Margaritas intend to go and will we go there so willingly? My God I Love the Game of RISK. It,s your move.
CanadaNorth, dear, it is YOUR turn to write an article. I’d rather you snagged Alaska than the Russians, and if you want Washington state and Oregon, take ‘em. Hugs, Linda
Who exacty is going to print the money you need when you break away from DC?
Dear Stanley: I suppose it depends upon who does the breaking away. One would think by now that everyone knew that printing money works only so long as the otherwise scrap script can be exchanged for something of actual intrinsic value, be that gold, silver, cowrie shells, kumquats, or carved ivory discs. It doesn’t matter WHAT the currency is based upon so long as those using it all agree on value. That reminds me of the story of a bunch playing Poker with jelly beans and one learning the black ones were valued at $5,000 each. Jelly Beans would not make a good standard. Crude oil would do if it weren’t so messy making change…Supposing an area became independent and reverted to the original Constitution, that document calls for minting gold and silver coins, period. After a cataclysmic event areas would stablize slowly, using a barter system and what gold and silver was held privately, one can only suppose. In time, the new country would get past paying the doctor with a chicken. The probabilities are that what there was or could be produced within the new borders would be all there was. Gentle smile…what you really wanted to ask was who was going to pay the bills for a revolution. I don’t know, which makes it fortunate that I am not planning one, doesn’t it?
What if we abolished the federal reserve and formed 50 new state banks with a new national currency. What if we declare the old currency dead and gone. We all would then owe nothing and start over. Doesn’t this plan accomplish the same thing as cessession without the possibility of civil war? We may as well do this soon because the national debt can never be repaid.
Tony, me darlin’ you’re so gloriously bright and inventive you never cease to delight me. What a perfectly splendid notion…except no one would believe that Texas would agree to give up our distinctive shape and culture. Hope this goes through–two to Jim didn’t. Hey, Jim, honest you’ve got answers coming! Any of you who haven’t read Tony’s latest at http://www.thetexasring have missed a rare treat. No gently snide fable, this time! Group hug, Linda
This is absurd and ignores the cause of the problem. 30 years of failed Republican economic policies (i.e. low taxes, anti-worker, outsourcing, etc.) have led us to this point. Deficits were never a problem while being run up by Reagan, Bush I and II. The bailouts were started by Bush II after nearly causing the 2nd Great Depression. By the way, you did vote on all of these things… you elected members of Congress. This is a representative republic, not a direct democracy. Also low tax states such as yours recieve much more in taxes than they send to Washington. If you want to succede please pay back all of the excess funds you have leached off of the rest of us first or pay your fair share and stop being a burden on the rest of us. In the future, please come up with some ideas that are serious solutions to our problems. Not some knee jerk, simplistic proposal such as this.
And when Mexico invades Arizona, who ya gonna call?
Rick, you got it half right. Now lets assign blame to the other head of the two headed snake. The Dems. If you’re bright enough to see half the problem, you’re not far from seeing the other half. Stop being a Party and try being an American. This will go a long way in clearing up your vision.
Sheriff Joe Arpaio!
And a pleasant morning to you, too. Thank you for the lesson in absurd knee jerk, simplistic proposals. There is no point in trying to disabuse you of your peculiarly partisan political views since they are based on faith, emotion, and disinformation, so I will merely point out that 150 years later over twice as many people are still disagreeing over precisely the same issues.
While the rest of us are enjoying ourselves I suggest that you ponder the difference–if there is any–between succeeding and seceding.
Mrs. John Charles Traynham
Dear Arizona Jefferson: In essence I like your intriguing proposal, but I see two points that have to be worked out. First, if we repudiate the Federal Reserve (a private corporation), we probably wouldn’t have to worry about civil wars, but don’t you think the Fed’s and the Feds’ creditors would be inclined to be a little bellicose? (See my archived article “They’re Going to Kill the Fed.”) Second, the only true solution involves currency backed by something tangible that we all agree has value, and throughout history that has almost always been precious metals. I have difficulty imagining fifty private banks agreeing on “beef or chicken?” or where to hold meetings. How would we work out the relative values of the products of the new banks? Yes, different currencies worked in Europe for centuries and there are still money changers, but a “dollar” doesn’t go as far in Washington state or NYC or Washington, D. C., as it does in San Antonio or Tuscaloosa. Keep thinking, please, because your idea has merit. If we posit that Congress has defaulted on the right to coin money, perhaps that devolves to the States under the tenth amendment. We could consult Dr. Michael Connolly…
Dear Don T: Whoa, you DO fight dirty! My only problem with your proposal is that the government would surely jail as many as possible and I might be one of them!
Dear DC62: When things post is tricky, which means we all need to check “earlier” postings. One problem with seeing this in terms of “net gain” states is that the money is taken from private individuals, put into a series of very leaky buckets, and dispensed almost exclusively on projects–and people–that the unwilling donors would not have undertaken themselves. We taxpayers always lose, and lose twice, because frequently such government largesse only gets a project started and the state is stuck with paying for it thereafter. I’m not a big fan of Governor Perry, but I certainly appreciated it when he–and other governors–declined politely to take recent money. How interesting it would be if our IRS forms, instead of asking if we want to contribute to campaign reform, asked us how we would like our individual taxes allocated. My surmise is that the military would do very well, a lot of citizens might be willing to fund roads, and only the hard core 14% of Statists would hand their money over joyously for bigger government, welfare, foreign aid, “climate” research, NPR, the National Endowment for the Arts, and so forth. A “state” is an artificial construct. I am no wealthier if–indeed–Texas gets more money given to our local politicians than was extorted from private citizens. I do not benefit in any way from the nine mil the nearest city spends or the nearly $200M the county frivols away. No, you can’t even ask, “But what about the fire department?” Sorry; this is county, and if anything catches fire we had better be prepared to handle it. More to the point, very little of that money (comparatively) is actually spent on police, firefighters, and roads.
Start martialing your arguments, dear readers, because tomorrow “Juggling Act” goes up suggesting we research munitions stocks–to profit from WWIII, not local activities. Thursday you get “The New Secessionists,” and we can divide up into the Bluebellies vs. the Reds or get intellectual and consider the success of a nation where c. 15% of the units admit to wanting a no-fault divorce. This is no healthier than a marriage where you can’t stand your spouse a minimum of one day a week in perpetuity. It makes me muse on hostile takeovers in the sense of corporations fighting off unwelcome suitors. Gracious, just because I concur with the Founding Fathers that two such dissimilar regions, lifestyles, and philosophies could not form an enduring nation does not mean that I am a fire-breathing, gun-wielding anarchist. I haven’t lifted anything heavier than a cigarette and a glass of wine all day, other than feeding a baby goat a 16-ounce bottle, and I do not own, or want to own, a fully automatic weapon. I haven’t the least notion how we could divide up the assets of this marriage equitably, but on almost all issues other than socialistic medicine, cap and trade, and the size of government the dismal fact remains that we are divided right at 50-50. That’s why “bipartisan” legislation is a farce doomed to failure. We don’t want the same things. Again, get Ronald & Donald Kennedy’s meticulously researched THE SOUTH WAS RIGHT. Go READ the correspondence between Lincoln and his generals! This will also give you the background–not available in texts written by the winners for 145 years–to understand that we are still at odds over exactly the same issues. The war didn’t solve anything other than impoverishing the South permanently (a major goal) and funding that corrupt Congress’ severe monetary problems.
Ms. Linda, this thought dove tails off of Don T.’s tax revolt. I heard there was a recent tax court case were some individuals accepted payment in Silver Eagles at market value as compensation for their services. On their paperwork for the IRS they claimed only the legal tender value the coins as their income. The judge smiled on the tax payer in this case and ruled that they had every right to claim the legal tender value stamped on the coins as their income. Now if I could just get the Navy to pay me in Silver Eagles at market equivalent to my salary…;-)
Walt, it has happened more than once, and the government pitched a hissy fit, but the juries smiled and said that face value is face value and the Feds can’t have it both ways. THAT is the problem with what FDR and Nixon did, that we cannot demand to be paid in specie. When are they going to let you be blue water Navy again? Hugs, L
Ms. Linda, I just thought of something else. Earlier you commented: “Gentle smile…what you really wanted to ask was who was going to pay the bills for a revolution. I don’t know, which makes it fortunate that I am not planning one, doesn’t it?” Most of the “disorders” around the globe have been and currently are financed by some variety of drug that has a constant demand. The colonials in North America used industrial hemp as barter before they had a unified currency. So, as we already know from sea to shining sea there is no place where both varieties (industrial and recreational) cannot be properly cultivated and brought to market. When I think back to your TEOWAWKI discussions the industrial hemp would be manna from heaven in the rural economy and the recreational variety can go in the peace pipe or the tea pot (which makes for a mighty fine Tea Party, let me tell ya!) and be remembered for its medicinal value. So I must close now by respectfully recommending that you and YDC set aside some of those “wild wood weed” seeds for that day that we prep for and pray never comes.
the problem as i see it is that the people have not been responsible and have allowed the take over of the us. it is the people that need to restore our constitutional republican form of government even by a rope over a tree branch. the inside terrorist residing in dc are far worse than those on the outside. as some one said,we have the best gov that the fiat money can buy. the money changers were thrown out once and needs to be repeated. education by gov controlled schools is a waste of the kids time and taxes. both are are part of the marx and lennin movement.
Amen Bert. The Tree of Liberty needs watering.
all kind of parties,political, today and i would like to rope in some to form a neck tie party. meetings could be held under a tree, a tree of liberty, and elected servants invited to attend and give a report on the oath of office and what they have done to abide by it. divide and concur or unite and concur? to unite builds a bigger defense.
Walt, you lunatic! If I start emulating our founding fathers and growing my own hemp to make my own rope (we’re all sure that’s why Jefferson kept such careful notes, right?!) and medicines the Powers That Be will confiscate everything I’ve got and throw me in the hoosegow. They aren’t going to want to hear that it makes great bird seed. (At one time 50% of commercial birdseed was sterilized marijuana.) Some generations’ source of rope, feed, and oil is another’s idea of the ultimate evil. Thought and mores change; the Victorians thought sex was dreadful, but that death and debtors’ prisons were completely normal. They smoked opium, drank laudanum by the quart, and fainted at the sight of an ankle. IS there any difference between industrial and medicinal marijuana? All I know is that during the seventeen hundreds plants were selected for height to improve the strength of the rope, and that human hair makes great rope. IF it were legal, which it is not, cannabis might well make great goat feed if it didn’t make them goofy. Until it is, I’m not going to experiment, thank you. I find the thought of incarceration and confiscation of my small assets a great deterrent. How dull of me, but there you have it. Linda
Dear Jim and Bert: Steady, there, fellows. It is neither wise nor safe nor sensible to advocate open violence against anything farther up the evolutionary scale than mosquitoes and Cass Sunstein is probably against THAT. “When in the course of human events it becomes NECESSARY…” Lynching and insurrection are not necessary, so turn all that passion into something useful, like finding and supporting candidates you think will abide by the Constitution, please. Cool heads, soft words, and implacable convictions will work better and keep you out of trouble.
Coming from you Linda, I’ll take that as a compliment.
Not sure what you think of Congressman Paul but I give him credit for the effort. When I reviewed the list of State Legislation at the site my own state of Illinois has looked at the idea but appears to be waiting on a cue from the Feds. Unfortunately the Republic of Texas as not bothered to explore the issue at all since the boys in Houston understandably would not a market competitor for the reserves that are already mapped out by the geologist and stored safely underground.
In any case I still think it wise for you and YDC to stash some seed stock with the rest of the end of days gear. Allows for a diversified crop portfolio for the ranch.
Walt, Love, we will stock everything that seems sensible. As for the Republic of Texas…talk to me about that Thursday!
It would be much preferable to what we have now, the issue is a lack of an adequate testosterone supply on the part of the states.
When I see a governor putting his troops into the cities and forcibly closing federal offices I’ll see hope.
All the legislatures are doing now is appeasement.
Action alone will tell.
next to last comment. had to reread about the 1770s history to correlate then and now. what action separated the colonies,13, from the british empire? are we not facing the same loss of freedom with the one worlder’s quest for a world empire? will the ballot box suffice? plowing around that stump,the 1913 slavery act, has not succeeded. the non violence approach is not doing the job.[admit it] comes to mind there are two types of people, one is satisfied,no over joyed with the gov providing for all needs.[using others money and unlimited credit] and the minority that feel you deserve what you work for. what action removed the money changers from the temple. least but not last, can the united states weather another ballot box solution as was programed last time.? a job,food on the table and a roof overhead is what we all want,but are not all getting it today and tomorrow.?
Well said, Sam. I’m working on an article about the BATF threatening Montana and Tennessee over gun legislation completely within the power of states. It declared that guns manufactured in, sold in, and possessed by citizens of those states were legal all the way up to just short of those which require two men to find and 4″ cannon. Thanks for writing. Linda
Bert, Babe, there are three ways to get money out of the bank: write a check/swipe your card, take out a loan, or hold the joint up. Where should you start for the best result? Here’s another way to put that: “Always start by being nice. You can always turn nasty if nice doesn’t work. However, it is very difficult to pitch a fit and then apologize and start over.” It is possible, but it isn’t the best way. Right now restoring the Republic is probably the dream of a few thousand at best but talking about it is a great start. I’m inspired enough to write my education packet, because I’m serious: so long as you aren’t a Statist, no matter what you want or think would be good for our country, the best answer is “Restore the Republic.” We’ve got to do it right, because this is the only chance we have to start over clean and without bloodshed. We aren’t ever going to get Washington to dismantle deleterious programs or deregulate. We have the law on our side, and the 1836 Constitution isn’t perfect but it is a great deal better than socialism.
What nations do americans compare themselves with when it comes to quality of life and standard of living? No doubt N.Korea comes to mind… the average working american does not have 4 weeks annual vacation, a 36 or 38 hour week, long service leave, holiday loading or a union to represent him, not to mention long term unemployment benifits or health care for all. 10 states do not allow felons to vote for life,yet demand they pay taxes. California has over 300 people serving 25 years to life for shoplifting. Its hard to find anything Americans have besides being able to own weapons that can wipe out your your shopping mall that really improves life.
I was curious if you ever thought of changing
the structure of your website? Its very well written; I love what youve got to say.
But maybe you could a little more in the way of content
so people could connect with it better. Youve got an awful lot of text for
only having one or two images. Maybe you could space it
Does your site have a contact page?
I’m having trouble locating it but, I’d like to send you an email.
I’ve got some ideas for your blog you might be interested in hearing. Either way, great site and I look forward to seeing it improve over time.
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